Note: Soul Sessions is produced as a podcast first and designed to be listened to. If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes the emotion and inflection meant to be conveyed by human voice. Our transcripts are created using AI and human transcribers, but may contain errors. Please check the corresponding audio before quoting.

PAUL:

When life gives you donut shops, make a dive bar. Hey, it's Paul Wolf with a front-row seat to conversations on culture from Jackson, Mississippi. We call our podcast Soul Sessions. It's the people, places and events that make the City With Soul Shine. On today's show, restaurateur Chaz Lindsay takes us inside his newest venture, Rowans, a neighborhood pub that's “family-friendly by day and a little loose at night.” From fried bologna sandwiches to Weenie Martinis (yes), we will explore how this former donut shop is being transformed into Belhaven's newest gathering spot. Plus, Chaz gives us a scoop on what's cooking at the upcoming JXN Food & Wine Festival.

So here we are Chaz, 2025, you're kicking it off with a bang and you've already got a new restaurant under your belt. How's that momentum treating you?

CHAZ:

You know, next week, Pulito will be two years old. We're not even two years old and we opened a new restaurant, a second restaurant in two years. But I mean, you know, it's that whole deal. You got to strike while the iron's hot, right? The real estate, the location is fantastic. It really helps that I have an existing restaurant directly across the street from it. That's a good support system. And it's, know, it's in the neighborhood; it's in Belhaven Town Center. And, and it's, it's something that I've invested in and want to be a part of. And so it just made a lot of sense and I wasn't going to let anybody else do it. Had to move, you know.

PAUL:

And perfect timing, too, with Fenian’s closing late last year, you kind of wanted to be a neighborhood pub. So tell me a little bit about that concept, about the idea that you'd have somewhere, maybe just down the street from your house where you could go and enjoy time with friends and some food and drinks.

CHAZ:

Yeah. I mean, it's, you know… yes, it is a bar, but I mean, I think that we're doing some pretty good food there as well. It's very simple, straightforward. My tagline right now is “family-friendly during the day, a little loose at night.” That's the goal with Rowan's right now, you know: super solid hamburger, crispy, delicious tater tots; we're figuring lunch out as we go with the blue plate and everything. And then we're going to start brunch here soon. But I think that, you know, what Mary Sanders and I were able to come up with as far as interior, you feel comfortable. You feel like the space has been there for a long time. We're not necessarily a replacement of Fenian’s. Cause I mean, you can't replace Fenian’s. Everybody has their own weird Fenian’s story, I have my own, you know, I certainly do. I spent a lot of time there. We're trying to provide a new gathering place for, for the neighborhood. It's a new updated version with a little bit more expanded menu and, a more modern take on what a neighborhood pub should be. Yeah.

PAUL:

Of course you talk about Mary Sanders, Ferris Cavicchi, whose imprint is all over Jackson restaurants at this point, including Pulito and now including Rowan's talk about that interior because the first time I walked in, I just felt like, wow, this is a cozy place. It feels clean. It was the former District Donut space at Belhaven Town Center, which it's very convenient for you that it's right across from Pulito, but that space just kind of lent itself to becoming more hospitable, didn’t it?

CHAZ:

Yeah, it did The building’s kind of got like that shotgun, New Orleans vibe, you know, long skinny, had those big windows in it that were East facing. I don't know if you remember going in there when it was District Donuts or even Campbell's. It was hot because the sun was blaring right into it. So that was like one of the first things. You think like dive bar, neighborhood dive bar, it's like kind of dark, wood, and low light and neon and dark colors. Right? So we knew we had to address those windows, which Chad Hatten built these like awesome inserts that go over it. They kind of give it this like old school diner vibe. We're adding more and more stuff onto the walls to make it more homey and cozy as we go. And I was just, I'm super happy with how it turned out. That's the comment that everyone generally makes.

And they did it with Pulito, too. I think Mary Sanders and I kind of have like… we work well together. We definitely frustrate each other a lot, but the end result is fantastic. People made that comment about Pulito as well. And Pulito was definitely like kind of out, not out of her comfort zone, but she just hadn't done anything like it. People were kind of used to her style being a certain way. People say that Pulito feels like it's been here for years. Rowan’s was a little bit easier because I was able to articulate more of what I wanted and send her inspiration from other places that inspired me. But the comment that we get now is people walk into Rowan's and like, “man, it feels like it's been here forever.” As a restaurant owner, you couldn't be happier with anything else. You know, you want people to walk into your space and feel immediately comfortable and welcome. We've achieved that at not one, but two restaurants now.

PAUL:

Well, I might think of some other things that would make you really happy, chef. Like if people said the food and drinks were amazing. And I know they are because I visited during the soft open. And that menu, it kind of has a genre to it, right? It's what you would expect, but in an elevated form at a pub, is that fair to say?

CHAZ:

Yeah, I think so. I mean, look, I have standards that I have to maintain just for my own personal integrity in the kitchen, right? And just because I'm doing like a pub bar menu doesn't mean I'm just going to throw everything that I've learned or what I pride myself on to the wayside. We still have standards, you know, we still have good practices that we need to follow with Pulito. It's very much, I have to stay in a lane. You know, I mean, we're charging a heck of a lot more money at Pulito for food than what we're charging at Rowan's. And, know, also Pulito is largely a seasonal Italian restaurant. I'm not doing carnitas, nachos at Pulito or anything like that. I have like my playbook and that's what I go by and depending on what's in season, that's what we go with at Pulito. Now across the street, if I want to do hot dog mac and cheese and throw like Flamin' Hot Cheetos on it, I'm going to do it, but it's going to be the best hot dog mac and cheese you've ever had in life, you know?

We still have integrity in what we do, but over there we can just have fun and screw around, you know, and we don't, we don't have to stay in a lane. Like, I don't know if I want to do a hibachi night over there or something like I'll do that. You know, if I, if I want to do a Chicago deep dish pizza one night, I'll do that. Like there's not a formula. We don't know what the formula is. We're trying to create it. We don't have to pigeonhole ourselves into one certain type of cuisine. So let's just have fun and make sure it's good.

PAUL:

Okay, you do deep dish and you save me a sausage and cheese, okay?

CHAZ:

You got it. Absolutely. Yeah. Well, it's a napalm casserole is what those things are. You know, I mean, you got to wait 45 minutes after he comes out of oven to eat it.

PAUL:

Yeah. And then 45 minutes for it to cook. So just settle in, grab something off the bar menu, which again is not pretentious at all. There's a list of beers, then there's a list of dark spirits and clear spirits. There aren't really any fancy cocktails on the Rowan’s menu. And I know that was intentional.

CHAZ:

Yeah. So we're going to start doing, we're, rolling out brunch in February. And so with brunch, we're going to put a few cocktails on there. Like this weekend, we started a cocktail called The Weenie Martini. It's Cathead Vodka washed with little smokey's, the little cocktail wieners. We render those out in a pan with a little bit of fat. And then basically just like dump it in into the Cathead Vodka, freeze it, let it solidify. The Cathead takes on that like smoky, sausage-y flavor and then we garnish it with like a deep-fried cocktail weenie, an olive, a cocktail onion and a hot chili. If we do cocktails, they're not going to be that serious. You know, we're just going to have fun with it. We're not going in and expanding our inventory with like a whole bunch of obscure spirits that are going to be used for one cocktail for one time. It's like, this is based on function and being reasonable and like, you know, keeping costs down and running a healthy business, but having fun doing it.

PAUL:

In all that, kind of also mentioned the B word and Jackson loves a good brunch, right?

CHAZ:

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, brunch is definitely going to, it's going to lean more towards traditional Mexican… just cause I love that cuisine. I lived in El Paso for four years, three and a half, four years. I want like a good chilaquiles. I want, you know, a good pozole. Like, I think our carnitas are killer across the street already. So we're going to get a little more traditional, like I want a good Aguachile, like in the summer, you know, like I want to have some of that stuff. I mean, we'll still have traditional American brunch, but I would have leaned more towards that.

PAUL:

Oh, that menu sounds delicious. Let's switch gears here for just a second, Chaz, and talk about the upcoming JXN Food & Wine Festival, which you're going to be a part of bringing your cuisine to the table. Do you know yet what is on your plate for March 15?

CHAZ:

Ummmm…. No, I really, I really have no clue! I don't know, I think I might use it as an opportunity. Like last year, I don't know. I thought my dish was great last year, but it got cold and like the vessel that I had wasn't the right vessel, so then it got like cold way too fast. And I don't want that to happen again. I'm thinking about maybe doing the bologna sandwich from Rowan's this year instead, especially since Rowan's is new. I don't know. It's a fried bologna sandwich. It's great. I'm excited about it. I thought last year was… the inaugural year… was great. There's a lot of fun. So that's exciting. The space is great. There's going to be some talented people there that, you know, are always fun to see.

PAUL:

What does it mean to have a festival like that? Here in Jackson, especially after such a successful first year.

CHAZ:

I think it's great. mean, I know that a lot of people have tried to get it off the ground for many years and then finally, you know, getting the Local Palette involved and, you know, you guys putting in a lot of hard work and also I think, you know, there's more, there's more people that are committed to it now from a chef standpoint. We've got some really, really good restaurants here in Jackson. Well, not just in Jackson, Mississippi in general, being able to showcase that and not just like, “there's lowly old Mississippi.” It’s like, no, there's some serious talent coming out of here. And being able to showcase that in a space that's awesome and gorgeous and really cool. I mean, that's, that's pretty amazing. It's a very good look for us, you know, and I'm happy to be a part of it.

PAUL:

That's Chaz Lindsay from Rowan's and Pulito at the Belhaven Town Center. If you haven't had Rowan's or even taken the time to check out the menu, head to our show notes to learn more. They're at visitjackson.com/soulsessions. This podcast is produced by Visit Jackson, the destination organization for Mississippi's capital city. Our executive producers are Jonathan Pettus and Dr. Ricky Thigpen and I'm our managing editor. You want to keep up with all the great things happening in our capital city? You can do that at visitjackson.com.

I'm Paul Wolf and you've been listening to Soul Sessions.

Listen to previous episodes of Soul Sessions